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Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?

microsoft.public.windowsupdate






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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2009
wds
 

Posts: n/a
Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?
Hello experts,

I recently installed WSUS 3 server on one of my systems. I have a Win2K3
server endpoint that uses WUA 2.0 (5.8.0.2694) to talk to WSUS. I was able
to run a scan on the endpoint using this combo (WSUS3 +WUA 2.0) and it seemed
to have worked. What I am not sure is that can it be assumed that WUA 2.0
will *always* function properly with WSUS 3.0? or Is WSUS 3.0 backword
compatible with earlier versions of windows Update Agent?

Apologies in advance if this question was hashed before ... Any tips/link
greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2009
PA Bear [MS MVP]
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?
[[ Right pew, wrong church. Forwarded to WSUS newsgroup
(microsoft.public.windows.server.update_services) via crosspost as a
convenience to OP.

On the web:
http://www.microsoft.com/communities... date_services

In your newsreader:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsof...pdate_services
]]

wds wrote:
> Hello experts,
>
> I recently installed WSUS 3 server on one of my systems. I have a Win2K3
> server endpoint that uses WUA 2.0 (5.8.0.2694) to talk to WSUS. I was
> able
> to run a scan on the endpoint using this combo (WSUS3 +WUA 2.0) and it
> seemed to have worked. What I am not sure is that can it be assumed that
> WUA 2.0 will *always* function properly with WSUS 3.0? or Is WSUS 3.0
> backword compatible with earlier versions of windows Update Agent?
>
> Apologies in advance if this question was hashed before ... Any tips/link
> greatly appreciated. Thanks.


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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2009
Lawrence Garvin [MVP]
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?
> wds wrote:

>> I recently installed WSUS 3 server on one of my systems. I have a Win2K3
>> server endpoint that uses WUA 2.0 (5.8.0.2694) to talk to WSUS. I was
>> able to run a scan on the endpoint using this combo (WSUS3 +WUA 2.0) and
>> it
>> seemed to have worked.


This is good news! It means you're WSUS Server is properly configured.

What actually happened is that the WUA first checks the selfupdate folder of
the WSUS Server, so the WSUS Server being v3, caused the WUA to immediately
"selfupdate" to the WUA v7.0 client (which ships on WSUS v3). If the
selfupdate had failed, no detection would have taken place. I assume that
"it seemed to have worked" means that your machine actually
detected/downloaded/installed needed/approved updates.


>> What I am not sure is that can it be assumed that
>> WUA 2.0 will *always* function properly with WSUS 3.0? or Is WSUS 3.0
>> backword compatible with earlier versions of windows Update Agent?


Neither of these, actually.

Technically speaking, WSUS 3 cannot support WUA v5.x clients; however, the
WUA v5.x client can selfupdate to the WUA v7.x client and then work with a
WSUS 3 server.

As noted above, correct functionality is dependent upon a successful
selfupdate -- which is, arguably, the most often failed component of WSUS 3.
So, no, it cannot be assumed that a WUA v5.x client will always function
properly with WSUS 3.0, because it's dependent on the WSUS 3.0 server having
a functioning selfupdate feature (which we've ostensibly established in this
case), and the WUA v5.x being properly configured and functional, unto
itself.

Plus, WSUS v3 is not "backward compatible" with earlier versions, because
the earlier versions must be updated to the latest version of the agent.

The other direction, however, is true. The WUA is backward compatible with
earlier versions of WSUS -- that is, the WUA v7.x client can successfully
update from a WSUS 2.0 server, should that be necessary. This is how
machines that have been connected to WU/MU (which promptly causes the update
of the WUA to the v7.x client), can still work in a WSUS v2 environment.


One other observation of interest: if you still have a WUA v5.8 client on
this Windows Server 2003 system, then it's either brand new (in which case
it should be baselined at Service Pack 2, which would have upgraded the WUA
to v7.x), or it's been eons since the server had any updates applied (which
is not a good thing in any circumstance), or it's been talking to a WSUS 2.0
server for some time, or it's been maintained with SMS2003 using ITMU v3.

FWIW, build v5.8.0.2694 was the build required to run ITMU v3 (Nov 2006), so
perhaps this machine has only been maintained by an SMS2003 installation? Or
perhaps it was built from an image configured to be used in an SMS2003
environment?

The WUA v7.x client was released with WSUS v3 and WU/MU in early 2007 -- the
only way I know of to have a WUA v5.8 client legitimately still on a machine
is one of those four scenarios I just identified -- so being concerned about
WSUS v3 working with 'downlevel' Windows Update Agent's may actually be
symptomatic of a more significant issue.


--
Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCITP:EA, MCDBA
Principal/CTO, Onsite Technology Solutions, Houston, Texas
Microsoft MVP - Software Distribution (2005-2009)

MS WSUS Website: http://www.microsoft.com/wsus
My Websites: http://www.onsitechsolutions.com;
http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com
My MVP Profile: http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/pro...awrence.Garvin

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2009
wds
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?
Thanks Lawrence for your extensive reply.

Just to clarify a bit, I am using W2k3 base image for my testing which I
often revert back depending on my scenarios. So, yes, it lacks various
updates including latest WUA. I am also using a third party tool to manage
updates (Tivoli Provisioning Manager 5.x). This tool installs WUA2 on my
endpoint.

As you indicated "selfupdate" should have occured on WUA 2.0 client but in
my case version info on wuaueng.dll still pointed to 5.8.0.2694 leading me to
believe that WUA2 woked "fine" with WSUS 3. Since I am still pretty new to
this I couldn't find any logs indicating "selfupdate" (if it ever occured)
failed.

If I am reading your response correctly WUA2.0 could never work with WSUS 3
unless selfupdating to WUA3. Perhaps there are other ways of checking
whether my WUA is indeed updated?

Yes, it "woked" refers to the fact that it was able to identify missing
patches on my system.


"Lawrence Garvin [MVP]" wrote:

> > wds wrote:

>
> >> I recently installed WSUS 3 server on one of my systems. I have a Win2K3
> >> server endpoint that uses WUA 2.0 (5.8.0.2694) to talk to WSUS. I was
> >> able to run a scan on the endpoint using this combo (WSUS3 +WUA 2.0) and
> >> it
> >> seemed to have worked.

>
> This is good news! It means you're WSUS Server is properly configured.
>
> What actually happened is that the WUA first checks the selfupdate folder of
> the WSUS Server, so the WSUS Server being v3, caused the WUA to immediately
> "selfupdate" to the WUA v7.0 client (which ships on WSUS v3). If the
> selfupdate had failed, no detection would have taken place. I assume that
> "it seemed to have worked" means that your machine actually
> detected/downloaded/installed needed/approved updates.
>
>
> >> What I am not sure is that can it be assumed that
> >> WUA 2.0 will *always* function properly with WSUS 3.0? or Is WSUS 3.0
> >> backword compatible with earlier versions of windows Update Agent?

>
> Neither of these, actually.
>
> Technically speaking, WSUS 3 cannot support WUA v5.x clients; however, the
> WUA v5.x client can selfupdate to the WUA v7.x client and then work with a
> WSUS 3 server.
>
> As noted above, correct functionality is dependent upon a successful
> selfupdate -- which is, arguably, the most often failed component of WSUS 3.
> So, no, it cannot be assumed that a WUA v5.x client will always function
> properly with WSUS 3.0, because it's dependent on the WSUS 3.0 server having
> a functioning selfupdate feature (which we've ostensibly established in this
> case), and the WUA v5.x being properly configured and functional, unto
> itself.
>
> Plus, WSUS v3 is not "backward compatible" with earlier versions, because
> the earlier versions must be updated to the latest version of the agent.
>
> The other direction, however, is true. The WUA is backward compatible with
> earlier versions of WSUS -- that is, the WUA v7.x client can successfully
> update from a WSUS 2.0 server, should that be necessary. This is how
> machines that have been connected to WU/MU (which promptly causes the update
> of the WUA to the v7.x client), can still work in a WSUS v2 environment.
>
>
> One other observation of interest: if you still have a WUA v5.8 client on
> this Windows Server 2003 system, then it's either brand new (in which case
> it should be baselined at Service Pack 2, which would have upgraded the WUA
> to v7.x), or it's been eons since the server had any updates applied (which
> is not a good thing in any circumstance), or it's been talking to a WSUS 2.0
> server for some time, or it's been maintained with SMS2003 using ITMU v3.
>
> FWIW, build v5.8.0.2694 was the build required to run ITMU v3 (Nov 2006), so
> perhaps this machine has only been maintained by an SMS2003 installation? Or
> perhaps it was built from an image configured to be used in an SMS2003
> environment?
>
> The WUA v7.x client was released with WSUS v3 and WU/MU in early 2007 -- the
> only way I know of to have a WUA v5.8 client legitimately still on a machine
> is one of those four scenarios I just identified -- so being concerned about
> WSUS v3 working with 'downlevel' Windows Update Agent's may actually be
> symptomatic of a more significant issue.
>
>
> --
> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCITP:EA, MCDBA
> Principal/CTO, Onsite Technology Solutions, Houston, Texas
> Microsoft MVP - Software Distribution (2005-2009)
>
> MS WSUS Website: http://www.microsoft.com/wsus
> My Websites: http://www.onsitechsolutions.com;
> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com
> My MVP Profile: http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/pro...awrence.Garvin
>
>

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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2009
Lawrence Garvin [MVP]
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Can WSUS 3.x support WUA 2.x clients?
"wds" <wds@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:8D0A34A6-67BE-432B-8335-9D6EA686C4CD@microsoft.com...

> If I am reading your response correctly WUA2.0 could never work with WSUS
> 3
> unless selfupdating to WUA3.


This is a correct statement.

> Perhaps there are other ways of checking
> whether my WUA is indeed updated?


The two most reliable ways are to check the file version on the wuauserv.dll
file, or review the %windir%\WindowsUpdate.log which records the current
version of the WUA at every detection event.

--
Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCITP:EA, MCDBA
Principal/CTO, Onsite Technology Solutions, Houston, Texas
Microsoft MVP - Software Distribution (2005-2009)

MS WSUS Website: http://www.microsoft.com/wsus
My Websites: http://www.onsitechsolutions.com;
http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com
My MVP Profile: http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/pro...awrence.Garvin

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