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backup in Vista

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2007
Eileen
 

Posts: n/a
backup in Vista
After only using Vista about two months and having an automatic weekly
backup, the backups started failing because it said there was no room on the
recovery drive. So I went in and deleted the backup files on the recovery
drive (I left the "sources" and "Windows" files).
Now the weekly backup just says it fails without saying why! What can I do?
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2007
John Hanley
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista

"Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E9147FB2-0678-45CF-8345-8B60EF319805@microsoft.com...
> After only using Vista about two months and having an automatic weekly
> backup, the backups started failing because it said there was no room on
> the
> recovery drive. So I went in and deleted the backup files on the recovery
> drive (I left the "sources" and "Windows" files).
> Now the weekly backup just says it fails without saying why! What can I
> do?


I believe the intent of Vista backup is to place the backed up files on a
separate drive, like DVD's or an external hard drive (which is what I use).
They don't want your backup to be on the same drive as your main hard drive
(mine is C, otherwise it is not much of a backup. That said, I do see
that the Backup and Restore function will let me choose a backup destination
on the Recovery drive (mine is D, which is actually a portion of the
regular physical hard drive. That seems to defeat most of the purpose of
having a backup. My Recovery (D "drive" shows a capacity of only 7 to 8
GB; I find that one regular file Backup takes 7 to 8 GB all by itself, so
the D: drive is not a good candidate for a backup destination. I am a
little surprised that the Backup and Restore function will even let you
choose the D: drive as a destination, but I do see that as an option in my
backup wizard. I suspect that your Recovery drive is chock-a-block full if
you are using it for Backup as well as Recovery. If you happen to try to
look at the files in the Recovery (D drive, you get this message:
------------------------------------
Warning!

This area of your hard drive
(or partition) contains files used
for your PC Recovery.

Do not delete or alter these files.

Any change to this partition could
prevent any recovery later.
---------------------------------------

I suggest you create another (independent) backup destination and do your
backups to that location (such as a separate hard drive, or DVD's). I tried
to use DV's for this, but it took forever and multiple DVD's, so I opted for
the separate external hard drive. Sorry this is so long, it takes me a
while to explain myself. Hope this helps.

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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2007
Rich
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
John,

This has also happened to me. My backup drive is a seperate 80gig hard
drive. What I have found is Vista backup (no matter what your settings are)
will not overwrite only the files that have been changed and insted creates a
whole new backup. My auto backups fail after about the third attempt because
there is no longer any room on the hard drive.

"John Hanley" wrote:

>
> "Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:E9147FB2-0678-45CF-8345-8B60EF319805@microsoft.com...
> > After only using Vista about two months and having an automatic weekly
> > backup, the backups started failing because it said there was no room on
> > the
> > recovery drive. So I went in and deleted the backup files on the recovery
> > drive (I left the "sources" and "Windows" files).
> > Now the weekly backup just says it fails without saying why! What can I
> > do?

>
> I believe the intent of Vista backup is to place the backed up files on a
> separate drive, like DVD's or an external hard drive (which is what I use).
> They don't want your backup to be on the same drive as your main hard drive
> (mine is C, otherwise it is not much of a backup. That said, I do see
> that the Backup and Restore function will let me choose a backup destination
> on the Recovery drive (mine is D, which is actually a portion of the
> regular physical hard drive. That seems to defeat most of the purpose of
> having a backup. My Recovery (D "drive" shows a capacity of only 7 to 8
> GB; I find that one regular file Backup takes 7 to 8 GB all by itself, so
> the D: drive is not a good candidate for a backup destination. I am a
> little surprised that the Backup and Restore function will even let you
> choose the D: drive as a destination, but I do see that as an option in my
> backup wizard. I suspect that your Recovery drive is chock-a-block full if
> you are using it for Backup as well as Recovery. If you happen to try to
> look at the files in the Recovery (D drive, you get this message:
> ------------------------------------
> Warning!
>
> This area of your hard drive
> (or partition) contains files used
> for your PC Recovery.
>
> Do not delete or alter these files.
>
> Any change to this partition could
> prevent any recovery later.
> ---------------------------------------
>
> I suggest you create another (independent) backup destination and do your
> backups to that location (such as a separate hard drive, or DVD's). I tried
> to use DV's for this, but it took forever and multiple DVD's, so I opted for
> the separate external hard drive. Sorry this is so long, it takes me a
> while to explain myself. Hope this helps.
>
>

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
John Hanley
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
Yes, I see that backup storage space could eventually be a problem. I plan
to experiment with manually deleting my old backups when I get a few more
under my belt. So far, all of my backups to the external hard drive total
only 16 GB out of the total available capacity of about 150 GB, so I have
lots of room for now. Yes, it would be nice if Vista deleted or overwrote
the old backups without us having to remember to do it manually.

"Rich" <Rich@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:FE80275A-9037-4DAE-B02D-667874CDD81B@microsoft.com...
> John,
>
> This has also happened to me. My backup drive is a seperate 80gig hard
> drive. What I have found is Vista backup (no matter what your settings
> are)
> will not overwrite only the files that have been changed and insted
> creates a
> whole new backup. My auto backups fail after about the third attempt
> because
> there is no longer any room on the hard drive.
>
> "John Hanley" wrote:
>
>>
>> "Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:E9147FB2-0678-45CF-8345-8B60EF319805@microsoft.com...
>> > After only using Vista about two months and having an automatic weekly
>> > backup, the backups started failing because it said there was no room
>> > on
>> > the
>> > recovery drive. So I went in and deleted the backup files on the
>> > recovery
>> > drive (I left the "sources" and "Windows" files).
>> > Now the weekly backup just says it fails without saying why! What can I
>> > do?

>>
>> I believe the intent of Vista backup is to place the backed up files on a
>> separate drive, like DVD's or an external hard drive (which is what I
>> use).
>> They don't want your backup to be on the same drive as your main hard
>> drive
>> (mine is C, otherwise it is not much of a backup. That said, I do see
>> that the Backup and Restore function will let me choose a backup
>> destination
>> on the Recovery drive (mine is D, which is actually a portion of the
>> regular physical hard drive. That seems to defeat most of the purpose of
>> having a backup. My Recovery (D "drive" shows a capacity of only 7 to
>> 8
>> GB; I find that one regular file Backup takes 7 to 8 GB all by itself, so
>> the D: drive is not a good candidate for a backup destination. I am a
>> little surprised that the Backup and Restore function will even let you
>> choose the D: drive as a destination, but I do see that as an option in
>> my
>> backup wizard. I suspect that your Recovery drive is chock-a-block full
>> if
>> you are using it for Backup as well as Recovery. If you happen to try to
>> look at the files in the Recovery (D drive, you get this message:
>> ------------------------------------
>> Warning!
>>
>> This area of your hard drive
>> (or partition) contains files used
>> for your PC Recovery.
>>
>> Do not delete or alter these files.
>>
>> Any change to this partition could
>> prevent any recovery later.
>> ---------------------------------------
>>
>> I suggest you create another (independent) backup destination and do your
>> backups to that location (such as a separate hard drive, or DVD's). I
>> tried
>> to use DV's for this, but it took forever and multiple DVD's, so I opted
>> for
>> the separate external hard drive. Sorry this is so long, it takes me a
>> while to explain myself. Hope this helps.
>>
>>


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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
Eileen
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
Well you're right, I should backup to an external drive anyway.
But is there any way to recover the use of my Recovery Drive (D? I'd still
like to have an automatic backup to save "snapshots" of settings and
everything, in case C: fails.
And yes, I believe the small D: Recovery Drive is the default for these
automatic backups (what were they thinking?).
The automatic backup feature was one of the reasons I got a non-Basic Vista...
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
Eileen
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
Oh, and I never got any warning not to alter files in the D: drive. I hope I
have not deleted anything unrecoverable. Vista came on my machine, so I don't
have any recovery disks.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
Mike Hall - MVP
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
A lack of warning is a failing on the part of the OEM computer
manufacturer.. tell them about it..



"Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:3F1E2DB1-29CB-4636-B31B-AAB14ECD0EA0@microsoft.com...
> Oh, and I never got any warning not to alter files in the D: drive. I hope
> I
> have not deleted anything unrecoverable. Vista came on my machine, so I
> don't
> have any recovery disks.


--


Mike Hall
MS MVP Windows Shell/User
http://msmvps.com/blogs/mikehall/



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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
John Hanley
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
From what I understand: the 'Recovery drive' feature (D is something
provided by the manufacturer of your computer (like Dell or HP), as a place
for your system to make Restore Points. and not something designed by
Microsoft or Windows or Vista. But Vista, per se, looks around for likely
destinations for your 'automatic backup' and sees this apparently available
separate 'drive' called D:, observes that it is different from your main
hard drive (C and suggests it as a location choice for your automatic
backup. One could say that Vista, per se, does not know that HP has set up
this D: drive on the same physical disc as the C: drive.

So, how do you know that you do *not* have use of your Recovery Drive (D?
The intended use of the recovery drive is for System Restore points; is D:
working for those? Perhaps a first thing to do on that is to check and
see whether your system has been making regular Restore points. On your
Start button, type System in the search box; then click on System Restore;
if you are prompted for an administrator password or confirmation, type the
password or provide confirmation by clicking Continue. In the System Restore
window that comes up, click on Next. This will give you a listing of all
the Restore Points for the last 5 days; if you want to look further back,
click the box for "Show restore points older than 5 days". My system has
Restore points about every day, and additional ones when there has been an
event like a Windows Update. The question at this point is whether you do
have one or more Restore points listed. If you do not, what *is* listed?
If you have several recent Restore Points, then your D: is working as
intended.

Keep in mind that it is *not* recommended that you use the D: drive as a
location for Automatic Backups, even though D: is given as one of the
location choices. Keep your D: drive strictly for System Restore points.
Check and see what you have and write back.


"Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:50EEA730-9C84-48E4-BB20-F9A1ECDEF91C@microsoft.com...
> Well you're right, I should backup to an external drive anyway.
> But is there any way to recover the use of my Recovery Drive (D? I'd
> still
> like to have an automatic backup to save "snapshots" of settings and
> everything, in case C: fails.
> And yes, I believe the small D: Recovery Drive is the default for these
> automatic backups (what were they thinking?).
> The automatic backup feature was one of the reasons I got a non-Basic
> Vista...


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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2007
Cal Bear '66
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
The Recovery Partition, D:, is NOT used for system created Restore Points.

It is an "image" of the system and programs originally installed by the factory.
It is used to "Recover" your system to a factory shipped default condition.

It has NOTHING to do with System Restore Points.

It should NOT be used for ANYTHING else -- not file backups, not Complete PC
Backup, nor temporary storage. Anyway, the available space is too small for
anything really useful.

Leave it alone -- unless you made recovery DVDs.

--
I Bleed Blue and Gold
GO BEARS!


"John Hanley" <jphanley@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:eSt6aqYwHHA.2040@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
> From what I understand: the 'Recovery drive' feature (D is something
> provided by the manufacturer of your computer (like Dell or HP), as a place
> for your system to make Restore Points. and not something designed by
> Microsoft or Windows or Vista. But Vista, per se, looks around for likely
> destinations for your 'automatic backup' and sees this apparently available
> separate 'drive' called D:, observes that it is different from your main
> hard drive (C and suggests it as a location choice for your automatic
> backup. One could say that Vista, per se, does not know that HP has set up
> this D: drive on the same physical disc as the C: drive.
>
> So, how do you know that you do *not* have use of your Recovery Drive (D?
> The intended use of the recovery drive is for System Restore points; is D:
> working for those? Perhaps a first thing to do on that is to check and
> see whether your system has been making regular Restore points. On your
> Start button, type System in the search box; then click on System Restore;
> if you are prompted for an administrator password or confirmation, type the
> password or provide confirmation by clicking Continue. In the System Restore
> window that comes up, click on Next. This will give you a listing of all
> the Restore Points for the last 5 days; if you want to look further back,
> click the box for "Show restore points older than 5 days". My system has
> Restore points about every day, and additional ones when there has been an
> event like a Windows Update. The question at this point is whether you do
> have one or more Restore points listed. If you do not, what *is* listed? If
> you have several recent Restore Points, then your D: is working as intended.
>
> Keep in mind that it is *not* recommended that you use the D: drive as a
> location for Automatic Backups, even though D: is given as one of the location
> choices. Keep your D: drive strictly for System Restore points. Check and see
> what you have and write back.
>
>
> "Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:50EEA730-9C84-48E4-BB20-F9A1ECDEF91C@microsoft.com...
>> Well you're right, I should backup to an external drive anyway.
>> But is there any way to recover the use of my Recovery Drive (D? I'd
>> still
>> like to have an automatic backup to save "snapshots" of settings and
>> everything, in case C: fails.
>> And yes, I believe the small D: Recovery Drive is the default for these
>> automatic backups (what were they thinking?).
>> The automatic backup feature was one of the reasons I got a non-Basic
>> Vista...

>



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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2007
Charles W Davis
 

Posts: n/a
Re: backup in Vista
Mike, et.al.
I bought a new HP with Vista Ultimate on March 31, 2007. Three days later,
it wouldn't let me continue without buring the recovery (D drive to DVDs.
It was a first time experience, I even got to use the Lightscribe to label
the disks. Do others simply ignore this somehow? I don't know how other HP
buyers have fared with this.
"Mike Hall - MVP" <mikehall@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:eYkANeWwHHA.5008@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>A lack of warning is a failing on the part of the OEM computer
>manufacturer.. tell them about it..
>
>
>
> "Eileen" <Eileen@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:3F1E2DB1-29CB-4636-B31B-AAB14ECD0EA0@microsoft.com...
>> Oh, and I never got any warning not to alter files in the D: drive. I
>> hope I
>> have not deleted anything unrecoverable. Vista came on my machine, so I
>> don't
>> have any recovery disks.

>
> --
>
>
> Mike Hall
> MS MVP Windows Shell/User
> http://msmvps.com/blogs/mikehall/
>
>
>


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