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Erratic Internet access using PPPoE

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-11-2007
SageAdvice
 

Posts: n/a
Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
Visat Home Premium 64 bit. WAN Miniport PPPoE configured for a cable Internet
Connection. Sometimes takes a long time to connect to the Internet, up to 5
minutes. Sometimes fails altogether but rarely. Once connected the network
map shows the PC, connected to Multiple Networks and then connected the
Internet. Often the last link shows a red X but the Internet connection
actually exists, I can ping web URLs and gain an IP address etc. However,
when the red X is present web pages cannot be reached use IE7. If the red X
is not present some web sites can be accessed but many others start to load
(eg waiting for www.nab.com.au) but gets no further. Packets are sent and
received (slowly) but nothing ever displays even after 1 hour. The PC uses
Pc-Cillin Internet Security. I have turned off the firewall and phishing etc,
no help. I have tried Windows Firewall on and off with/without Pc-Cillin's
firewall. IPCONFIG /all shows the correct IP address for the PPP adapter with
a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255, but not gateway. The Ethernet port shows
the "random" 169.254.276.163 address with 255.255.0.0 subnet and no gateway.
I have tried setting up a new PPPoE connection using a different account with
a different ISP, same thing. If I connect the PC via a router everything
works just fine, all web sites are accessible.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-11-2007
GTS
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
I've never heard of using PPPoE for cable broadband. That's normally only
used for DSL. Is your router configured for PPPoE? Wth most cable systems
the default local connection just works directly.

--
"SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:88FA40FF-E76A-45BC-B56F-1AACE9C2178C@microsoft.com...
> Visat Home Premium 64 bit. WAN Miniport PPPoE configured for a cable
> Internet
> Connection. Sometimes takes a long time to connect to the Internet, up to
> 5
> minutes. Sometimes fails altogether but rarely. Once connected the network
> map shows the PC, connected to Multiple Networks and then connected the
> Internet. Often the last link shows a red X but the Internet connection
> actually exists, I can ping web URLs and gain an IP address etc. However,
> when the red X is present web pages cannot be reached use IE7. If the red
> X
> is not present some web sites can be accessed but many others start to
> load
> (eg waiting for www.nab.com.au) but gets no further. Packets are sent and
> received (slowly) but nothing ever displays even after 1 hour. The PC
> uses
> Pc-Cillin Internet Security. I have turned off the firewall and phishing
> etc,
> no help. I have tried Windows Firewall on and off with/without Pc-Cillin's
> firewall. IPCONFIG /all shows the correct IP address for the PPP adapter
> with
> a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255, but not gateway. The Ethernet port shows
> the "random" 169.254.276.163 address with 255.255.0.0 subnet and no
> gateway.
> I have tried setting up a new PPPoE connection using a different account
> with
> a different ISP, same thing. If I connect the PC via a router everything
> works just fine, all web sites are accessible.


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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-12-2007
SageAdvice
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
GTS, thanks for replying, but for for eductaionPPPoE means Point to Point
Protocol over Ethernet. Is is how all cable/DSL connections work. The
alternative is PPPoA (over analogue) which is sometimes used for ADSL
(Asynchronous Digital Subscriber Line). Cable connections are inherently DSL.
A cable router makes the PPPoE connection for you, thus enabling one ISP
connection to a) be always on regardless of any PC being on and b) be shared
amongst several PC without a specific PC being turned on. In the absence of a
router one can use a "dial up" connection from within Windows to make the
connection. In XP and Vista this uses a WAN (Wide Area Network) miniport
(virtual hardware) to make the PPPoE connection. That is, the WAN miniport
does the job of the router.

"GTS" wrote:

> I've never heard of using PPPoE for cable broadband. That's normally only
> used for DSL. Is your router configured for PPPoE? Wth most cable systems
> the default local connection just works directly.
>
> --
> "SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:88FA40FF-E76A-45BC-B56F-1AACE9C2178C@microsoft.com...
> > Visat Home Premium 64 bit. WAN Miniport PPPoE configured for a cable
> > Internet
> > Connection. Sometimes takes a long time to connect to the Internet, up to
> > 5
> > minutes. Sometimes fails altogether but rarely. Once connected the network
> > map shows the PC, connected to Multiple Networks and then connected the
> > Internet. Often the last link shows a red X but the Internet connection
> > actually exists, I can ping web URLs and gain an IP address etc. However,
> > when the red X is present web pages cannot be reached use IE7. If the red
> > X
> > is not present some web sites can be accessed but many others start to
> > load
> > (eg waiting for www.nab.com.au) but gets no further. Packets are sent and
> > received (slowly) but nothing ever displays even after 1 hour. The PC
> > uses
> > Pc-Cillin Internet Security. I have turned off the firewall and phishing
> > etc,
> > no help. I have tried Windows Firewall on and off with/without Pc-Cillin's
> > firewall. IPCONFIG /all shows the correct IP address for the PPP adapter
> > with
> > a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255, but not gateway. The Ethernet port shows
> > the "random" 169.254.276.163 address with 255.255.0.0 subnet and no
> > gateway.
> > I have tried setting up a new PPPoE connection using a different account
> > with
> > a different ISP, same thing. If I connect the PC via a router everything
> > works just fine, all web sites are accessible.

>
>

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-12-2007
GTS
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
Thank you for the "education," but I'm a network professional and understand
the protocols. I notice now that your are in Australia and it appears
things are different there. Here in the US cable broadband rarely, if ever,
uses PPPOE. Most, though not all, DSL connections do.

Since you have no problem with the router, there would seem to be
communication problem between the computer and cable modem. Although not
strictly applicable you might take a look at
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/928233/en-us
If that's no help you might try a different NIC. There aren't a lot of 64
bit drivers out yet and some are flaky.
Good luck.
--

"SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:20C377BF-62C3-4839-8309-73EE370756B0@microsoft.com...
> GTS, thanks for replying, but for for eductaionPPPoE means Point to Point
> Protocol over Ethernet. Is is how all cable/DSL connections work. The
> alternative is PPPoA (over analogue) which is sometimes used for ADSL
> (Asynchronous Digital Subscriber Line). Cable connections are inherently
> DSL.
> A cable router makes the PPPoE connection for you, thus enabling one ISP
> connection to a) be always on regardless of any PC being on and b) be
> shared
> amongst several PC without a specific PC being turned on. In the absence
> of a
> router one can use a "dial up" connection from within Windows to make the
> connection. In XP and Vista this uses a WAN (Wide Area Network) miniport
> (virtual hardware) to make the PPPoE connection. That is, the WAN miniport
> does the job of the router.
>
> "GTS" wrote:
>
>> I've never heard of using PPPoE for cable broadband. That's normally
>> only
>> used for DSL. Is your router configured for PPPoE? Wth most cable
>> systems
>> the default local connection just works directly.
>>
>> --
>> "SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:88FA40FF-E76A-45BC-B56F-1AACE9C2178C@microsoft.com...
>> > Visat Home Premium 64 bit. WAN Miniport PPPoE configured for a cable
>> > Internet
>> > Connection. Sometimes takes a long time to connect to the Internet, up
>> > to
>> > 5
>> > minutes. Sometimes fails altogether but rarely. Once connected the
>> > network
>> > map shows the PC, connected to Multiple Networks and then connected the
>> > Internet. Often the last link shows a red X but the Internet
>> > connection
>> > actually exists, I can ping web URLs and gain an IP address etc.
>> > However,
>> > when the red X is present web pages cannot be reached use IE7. If the
>> > red
>> > X
>> > is not present some web sites can be accessed but many others start to
>> > load
>> > (eg waiting for www.nab.com.au) but gets no further. Packets are sent
>> > and
>> > received (slowly) but nothing ever displays even after 1 hour. The PC
>> > uses
>> > Pc-Cillin Internet Security. I have turned off the firewall and
>> > phishing
>> > etc,
>> > no help. I have tried Windows Firewall on and off with/without
>> > Pc-Cillin's
>> > firewall. IPCONFIG /all shows the correct IP address for the PPP
>> > adapter
>> > with
>> > a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255, but not gateway. The Ethernet port
>> > shows
>> > the "random" 169.254.276.163 address with 255.255.0.0 subnet and no
>> > gateway.
>> > I have tried setting up a new PPPoE connection using a different
>> > account
>> > with
>> > a different ISP, same thing. If I connect the PC via a router
>> > everything
>> > works just fine, all web sites are accessible.

>>
>>


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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2007
SageAdvice
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
I've tried the 928233 fix but it did not help (works well with getting an IP
address from a router though).
Certainly something odd happening in the Network Address Translation (NAT)
area I think as I can see packets go out when I try to access a new web page
and some come back through the WAN Miniport but none make it back to the NIC
(as far as Vista reports anyway).
The other odd thing is I get different results on each boot session, and I
usually have to reboot when changing from router based to WANMiniport based
or vice versa. On the odd occasion when I do get a clear connection via WAN
Miniport in the network map with no red X between the "multuiple networks"
and the"Internert" the Mange Network Connections shows the Local Area
Connection (Ethernet port, or NIC) as disconnected!
The built in NIC definately works OK in that it is 100% fine when working
through a router or using a cross-over cable directly to another PC.
I have updated drivers, I have unistalled and reinstalled drivers to no
avail. Something in software as I can, without really changing anything and
even after putting everything back how it was, get a complete loss of
connection via WAN miniport but if I use System Restore I get back to the
normal but erratic condition.

The only difference in IPCONFIG /all between a 100% working set up in XP and
the same but malfunctioning in Vista is the absence of a gateway address in
Vista for the PPP adapater. But I can find no way to give it one.

> Since you have no problem with the router, there would seem to be
> communication problem between the computer and cable modem. Although not
> strictly applicable you might take a look at
> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/928233/en-us
> If that's no help you might try a different NIC. There aren't a lot of 64
> bit drivers out yet and some are flaky.
> Good luck.
> --
>
> "SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:20C377BF-62C3-4839-8309-73EE370756B0@microsoft.com...
> > GTS, thanks for replying, but for for eductaionPPPoE means Point to Point
> > Protocol over Ethernet. Is is how all cable/DSL connections work. The
> > alternative is PPPoA (over analogue) which is sometimes used for ADSL
> > (Asynchronous Digital Subscriber Line). Cable connections are inherently
> > DSL.
> > A cable router makes the PPPoE connection for you, thus enabling one ISP
> > connection to a) be always on regardless of any PC being on and b) be
> > shared
> > amongst several PC without a specific PC being turned on. In the absence
> > of a
> > router one can use a "dial up" connection from within Windows to make the
> > connection. In XP and Vista this uses a WAN (Wide Area Network) miniport
> > (virtual hardware) to make the PPPoE connection. That is, the WAN miniport
> > does the job of the router.
> >
> > "GTS" wrote:
> >
> >> I've never heard of using PPPoE for cable broadband. That's normally
> >> only
> >> used for DSL. Is your router configured for PPPoE? Wth most cable
> >> systems
> >> the default local connection just works directly.
> >>
> >> --
> >> "SageAdvice" <SageAdvice@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> >> news:88FA40FF-E76A-45BC-B56F-1AACE9C2178C@microsoft.com...
> >> > Visat Home Premium 64 bit. WAN Miniport PPPoE configured for a cable
> >> > Internet
> >> > Connection. Sometimes takes a long time to connect to the Internet, up
> >> > to
> >> > 5
> >> > minutes. Sometimes fails altogether but rarely. Once connected the
> >> > network
> >> > map shows the PC, connected to Multiple Networks and then connected the
> >> > Internet. Often the last link shows a red X but the Internet
> >> > connection
> >> > actually exists, I can ping web URLs and gain an IP address etc.
> >> > However,
> >> > when the red X is present web pages cannot be reached use IE7. If the
> >> > red
> >> > X
> >> > is not present some web sites can be accessed but many others start to
> >> > load
> >> > (eg waiting for www.nab.com.au) but gets no further. Packets are sent
> >> > and
> >> > received (slowly) but nothing ever displays even after 1 hour. The PC
> >> > uses
> >> > Pc-Cillin Internet Security. I have turned off the firewall and
> >> > phishing
> >> > etc,
> >> > no help. I have tried Windows Firewall on and off with/without
> >> > Pc-Cillin's
> >> > firewall. IPCONFIG /all shows the correct IP address for the PPP
> >> > adapter
> >> > with
> >> > a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255, but not gateway. The Ethernet port
> >> > shows
> >> > the "random" 169.254.276.163 address with 255.255.0.0 subnet and no
> >> > gateway.
> >> > I have tried setting up a new PPPoE connection using a different
> >> > account
> >> > with
> >> > a different ISP, same thing. If I connect the PC via a router
> >> > everything
> >> > works just fine, all web sites are accessible.
> >>
> >>

>
>

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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2007
Laur123
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
i have the same problem Windows vista ultimate 32 bit whit my onboard network
adapter conection to pppoe work fine exept i cant acces microsoft site's and
more but work. If i conect the same pppoe conection via router everthig is ok
and work great(all site) no problem.
I put a pci lan network adapter (intel R pro something wery old) in my
motherboard and work whit direct conection like via router conection
I change my motherboard but have the same problem whit built in lan (on both
motherboard i have built in Nvidia network adapter)
so the problem is whit pppoe or built in adapter or jeus whit nvidia network
adapert because have built in a driver a harware fire wall (i can-t find a
solution to disabel this)
--
:-) i hope was useful



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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2007
SageAdvice
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Erratic Internet access using PPPoE
Thanks Laur123. I think we are getting somewhere.
I too began to suspect the drivers or the Network adapter (NIC). So I
installed WinXP on another hard disk and that worked just fine on the
customer's motherboard.
So I then installed Vista Home 32 bit version on the same motherboard. That
too worked fine.
I then did a clean install of Vista Home 64 bit and the problem returned.
The customer actually thinks this probalem has been there frm the off, but
did not report it. So not something which has just broken.
And yes, this is a nVidia chipset motherboard. So I tried on another
motherboard. also nVidia but different manufacturer. Same result.
So, I put a PCI RealTek 8139 in, bingo, it all works as planned.
So, it looks like a 64 bit driver issue. I'll repprt this back to my
supplier and see what happens.
Glad to have confirmationof the fix on another system though.

"Laur123" wrote:

> i have the same problem Windows vista ultimate 32 bit whit my onboard network
> adapter conection to pppoe work fine exept i cant acces microsoft site's and
> more but work. If i conect the same pppoe conection via router everthig is ok
> and work great(all site) no problem.
> I put a pci lan network adapter (intel R pro something wery old) in my
> motherboard and work whit direct conection like via router conection
> I change my motherboard but have the same problem whit built in lan (on both
> motherboard i have built in Nvidia network adapter)
> so the problem is whit pppoe or built in adapter or jeus whit nvidia network
> adapert because have built in a driver a harware fire wall (i can-t find a
> solution to disabel this)
> --
> :-) i hope was useful
>
>
>

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