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Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?

microsoft.public.windows.vista.networking sharing






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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10-24-2007
User
 

Posts: n/a
Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
Had two XP machines connected together hardwire hub and cable. Everything
worked flawlessly for sharing, but after one XP machine got upgraded to
Vista then the problems began. I have read these groups for many days now
and seen and tried several links and suggestions but cannot solve this
problem. The upgraded machine can see and share the other XP machine just
fine but the XP machine cannot access the Vista machine other than the
Public folder.

ALL computers have the same workgroup name
Network set to private
Network discovery ON
File Sharing ON
Public folder sharing ON
Password protected OFF

I can see and share the Vista Public folder but this will not work for what
we need. We must share the Root of both drives. If it matters when I right
click the C: drive on the Vista machine the Share button is grayed out so to
enable sharing I had to go the Advance route. Have turned off Firewalls and
the only Antivirus on both machines is AVG Free version.

All the best,
George


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 10-24-2007
Malke
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
User wrote:
> Had two XP machines connected together hardwire hub and cable. Everything
> worked flawlessly for sharing, but after one XP machine got upgraded to
> Vista then the problems began. I have read these groups for many days now
> and seen and tried several links and suggestions but cannot solve this
> problem. The upgraded machine can see and share the other XP machine just
> fine but the XP machine cannot access the Vista machine other than the
> Public folder.
>
> ALL computers have the same workgroup name
> Network set to private
> Network discovery ON
> File Sharing ON
> Public folder sharing ON
> Password protected OFF
>
> I can see and share the Vista Public folder but this will not work for what
> we need. We must share the Root of both drives. If it matters when I right
> click the C: drive on the Vista machine the Share button is grayed out so to
> enable sharing I had to go the Advance route. Have turned off Firewalls and
> the only Antivirus on both machines is AVG Free version.


To share the root of a drive in Vista (not recommended from a security
standpoint, but you know what you need):

***
from Michael Bell - MS

When you share out the root of a drive in Vista, the UI only allows this
through the advanced sharing option. When the advanced sharing option
is used it only sets the share permissions. The actual permissions on a
file share are a combination of Folder and Share permissions. In Vista
the everyone group doesn not have permissions so when you connect
without a password the system you can see the folders but not access
them or possibly connect to the share but fail to open it.

1. Open Computer
2. Right click on the shared drive and select properties from the
context menu
3. Select the Security Tab in the displayed properties sheet.

If you are connecting to the computer with no password then you are
connecting with the guest account. In order to access the files on the
drive, the everyone group needs to have access set here.
***

To do the above properly, create identical user accounts and passwords
on all machines. If you wish a machine to boot directly to the Desktop
(into one particular user's account) for convenience, you can do this.
The instructions at this link work for both XP and Vista:

Configure Windows to Automatically Login (MVP Ramesh) -
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/Autologon.htm


Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 10-24-2007
User
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
Malke,

Thanks for the response, will give it a try tomorrow and let you know.

"Malke" <notreally@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:OP$5zwjFIHA.3548@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> User wrote:
>> Had two XP machines connected together hardwire hub and cable. Everything
>> worked flawlessly for sharing, but after one XP machine got upgraded to
>> Vista then the problems began. I have read these groups for many days now
>> and seen and tried several links and suggestions but cannot solve this
>> problem. The upgraded machine can see and share the other XP machine just
>> fine but the XP machine cannot access the Vista machine other than the
>> Public folder.
>>
>> ALL computers have the same workgroup name
>> Network set to private
>> Network discovery ON
>> File Sharing ON
>> Public folder sharing ON
>> Password protected OFF
>>
>> I can see and share the Vista Public folder but this will not work for
>> what we need. We must share the Root of both drives. If it matters when I
>> right click the C: drive on the Vista machine the Share button is grayed
>> out so to enable sharing I had to go the Advance route. Have turned off
>> Firewalls and the only Antivirus on both machines is AVG Free version.

>
> To share the root of a drive in Vista (not recommended from a security
> standpoint, but you know what you need):
>
> ***
> from Michael Bell - MS
>
> When you share out the root of a drive in Vista, the UI only allows this
> through the advanced sharing option. When the advanced sharing option is
> used it only sets the share permissions. The actual permissions on a file
> share are a combination of Folder and Share permissions. In Vista the
> everyone group doesn not have permissions so when you connect without a
> password the system you can see the folders but not access them or
> possibly connect to the share but fail to open it.
>
> 1. Open Computer
> 2. Right click on the shared drive and select properties from the context
> menu
> 3. Select the Security Tab in the displayed properties sheet.
>
> If you are connecting to the computer with no password then you are
> connecting with the guest account. In order to access the files on the
> drive, the everyone group needs to have access set here.
> ***
>
> To do the above properly, create identical user accounts and passwords on
> all machines. If you wish a machine to boot directly to the Desktop (into
> one particular user's account) for convenience, you can do this. The
> instructions at this link work for both XP and Vista:
>
> Configure Windows to Automatically Login (MVP Ramesh) -
> http://windowsxp.mvps.org/Autologon.htm
>
>
> Malke
> --
> Elephant Boy Computers
> www.elephantboycomputers.com
> "Don't Panic!"
> MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User



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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2007
ELW
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?

"Malke" <notreally@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:OP$5zwjFIHA.3548@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> To do the above properly, create identical user accounts and passwords on
> all machines. If you wish a machine to boot directly to the Desktop (into
> one particular user's account) for convenience, you can do this. The
> instructions at this link work for both XP and Vista:
>


Is this an absolute necessity? In my case, my wife and I are actually
different people with separate passwords and user names -- this was set up
this way when we booted and set up our systems for the first time, not
knowing we had to use SAME names and passwords. I have tried everything to
share files on our clean network, other than the Public Folder, which shares
fine, and of course the printer shares fine too. Note: Vista to XP is fine,
but XP to Vista is very limited.

What about turning of Simple File Sharing on my XP system. Could that have
something to do with it? Thanks again.



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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2007
Malke
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
ELW wrote:

> Is this an absolute necessity? In my case, my wife and I are actually
> different people with separate passwords and user names -- this was set up
> this way when we booted and set up our systems for the first time, not
> knowing we had to use SAME names and passwords. I have tried everything to
> share files on our clean network, other than the Public Folder, which shares
> fine, and of course the printer shares fine too. Note: Vista to XP is fine,
> but XP to Vista is very limited.
>
> What about turning of Simple File Sharing on my XP system. Could that have
> something to do with it? Thanks again.


You're misunderstanding the identical user accounts/passwords bit. You
don't have to log in with the same account and use the same password as
your wife - you just need to have the same accounts/passwords for the
users on the two computers. In a Workgroup (peer-to-peer networking with
no server), authentication is done locally.

As for Simple File Sharing, see:

f one or more of the computers is XP Pro or Media Center:

1. If you need Pro's ability to set fine-grained permissions, turn off
Simple File Sharing (Folder Options>View tab) and create identical user
accounts/passwords on all computers.

2. If you don't care about using Pro's advanced features, leave the
Simple File Sharing enabled.

Simple File Sharing means that Guest (network) is enabled. This means
that anyone without a user account on the target system can use its
resources. This is a security hole but only you can decide if it matters
in your situation.

I think it is a good idea to create the identical user
accounts/passwords in any case when Vista machines are involved and it
isn't an onerous task with home/small networks.


Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2007
Ernliz
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
On Oct 25, 2:44 pm, Malke <notrea...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> You're misunderstanding the identical user accounts/passwords bit. You
> don't have to log in with the same account and use the same password as
> your wife - you just need to have the same accounts/passwords for the
> users on the two computers. In a Workgroup (peer-to-peer networking with
> no server), authentication is done locally.
>


Thanks Malke, and I'll have to get really basic now. I STILL don't
understand what you mean in your paragraph above. Sorry. After many
years of computer use and successful networking with ME and XP
systems, I just don't understand what you mean by "identical" accounts/
passwords!" OK........... we log on to our separate Vista and XP
computers during boot up with our different names and passwords.
That's it! We are never asked for any more user/password accounts
ever again while trying to share files (and during our successful
sharing between XP and the Vista Public Folder).

I guess the best way to ask the question again is: just when and where
is this "same account/passwords" required? Not during bootup, as you
say, right? If not, then when? Note that in my Vista sharing
attempts I have password protection turned off. And again, note that
I CAN share files FROM my XP to Vista but not FROM VISTA to my XP (and
printer sharing works). The ONLY problem is getting Vista to share
its files (marked as shared) to the XP.

Sorry again. LIke you say, I just don't get the identical user
accounts/passwords bit.

EW

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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2007
Malke
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ?
Ernliz wrote:

> Thanks Malke, and I'll have to get really basic now. I STILL don't
> understand what you mean in your paragraph above. Sorry. After many
> years of computer use and successful networking with ME and XP
> systems, I just don't understand what you mean by "identical" accounts/
> passwords!" OK........... we log on to our separate Vista and XP
> computers during boot up with our different names and passwords.
> That's it! We are never asked for any more user/password accounts
> ever again while trying to share files (and during our successful
> sharing between XP and the Vista Public Folder).
>
> I guess the best way to ask the question again is: just when and where
> is this "same account/passwords" required? Not during bootup, as you
> say, right? If not, then when? Note that in my Vista sharing
> attempts I have password protection turned off. And again, note that
> I CAN share files FROM my XP to Vista but not FROM VISTA to my XP (and
> printer sharing works). The ONLY problem is getting Vista to share
> its files (marked as shared) to the XP.
>
> Sorry again. LIke you say, I just don't get the identical user
> accounts/passwords bit.


Windows 9x/ME were not true multi-user operating systems (and had no
permissions/restrictions structure) so what worked with them is not at
all applicable to any NT-based operating system - NT, Windows 2000, XP,
Vista.

1. Go to the Vista machine>Control Panel>User Accounts. Look at the
names of the user accounts. You should have one for you, one for your
wife (standard user accounts), and at least one extra Administrative
account for emergencies - call it "Tech" or whatever you like.

2. Go to the XP machine>Control Panel>User Accounts. Look at the names
of the user accounts. If they do not match the ones on the Vista box,
add the missing user accounts (with the exception of the extra Tech
account, although it will not hurt to create it). If there are user
accounts on the XP box that aren't on the Vista box, go back to the
Vista box and add them there.

You now have user accounts on both computers that are identical.

3. You still have not told me what version of XP you have - Home, Pro,
or Media Center. If you have Home, stop there. If you have Pro or Media
Center, go to Control Panel>Folder Options>View tab and make sure that
Simple File Sharing is unchecked. You do not have this option in Home.

4. For easier networking, I always suggest assigning passwords to user
accounts. With only two computers involved this is hardly an onerous
task and you can set each machine to automatically log onto a desired
user account for convenience. This means that you can assign a password
to your computer on the XP box (and make sure you create the same
password on your user account on the Vista box) and then use control
userpasswords2 to automatically log in. This will give the effect of
taking you directly to your Desktop when you start Windows. You can do
the same thing on the Vista box with your wife's account so she
automatically gets logged in and goes directly to *her* Desktop. The
process works the same in both XP and Vista:

Configure Windows to Automatically Login (MVP Ramesh) -
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/Autologon.htm

Real-world example:

Let's say I have three user accounts on all my machines *with*
passwords, all identical because they have to match - malke, leah, roberto.

I am logged into the MacBook as malke.
Leah is logged into XP Pro as leah.
Roberto is logged into Vista as roberto.

When Leah needs a shared resource from Roberto's Vista box, Vista sees
that the user leah exists on it and allows the connection. This is what
is meant by "local authentication" which is what is done in peer-to-peer
networking. This is a simplification of course but a workable one for
illustrative purposes.

If Vista (or XP) does *not* find a user account for leah, it will pop up
a dialog box asking for the username and password of a user who *is*
authorized to get that shared resource. So if the leah account didn't
exist, Leah could enter malke's username and password (if she knew it).

If all of that doesn't help, I don't know what else to suggest to you.
If you create identical user accounts/passwords and still can't use the
XP resource, then you probably have a misconfigured firewall.


Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2007
Malke
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ? - Addendum
Malke wrote:


> Let's say I have three user accounts on all my machines *with*
> passwords, all identical because they have to match - malke, leah, roberto.


Addendum because the above might be ambiguous - the passwords for the
user accounts can all be different. Malke, leah, and roberto all have
different passwords (or the same, it doesn't matter!) but the same
passwords must exist on the other computer.

Computer 1's users/passwords == Computer 2's users/passwords


Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 10-31-2007
ELW
 

Posts: n/a
Re: Yet another Vista-Xp Network ? - Addendum

"Malke" <notreally@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:e8LKCLvGIHA.3768@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> Malke wrote:
>
>
>> Let's say I have three user accounts on all my machines *with* passwords,
>> all identical because they have to match - malke, leah, roberto.

>
> Addendum because the above might be ambiguous - the passwords for the user
> accounts can all be different. Malke, leah, and roberto all have different
> passwords (or the same, it doesn't matter!) but the same passwords must
> exist on the other computer.
>
> Computer 1's users/passwords == Computer 2's users/passwords


Thanks M..... for the incredible info and advice in this and the previous
message. I'm going to spend lots of time digesting it all and applying it.
Sorry to have put you through this ordeal of mine but I think I have a
handle now. Best regards.

EW


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