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How to set up dual booting

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
rubyjack
 

Posts: n/a
How to set up dual booting
I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to set
it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete novice
to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a few
questions for me, I'd be very grateful.

If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do I
have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?
And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?


Thanks in advance,
Dan Hacker

--

-----------
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
-----------


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Carey Frisch [MVP]
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
It is not recommended to attempt to configure a
dual-boot configuration with a factory preinstalled
version of Windows Vista. You'll likely end up
destroying your entire hard drive and have no
operating system at all. Besides, your new Dell
computer likely does not support Windows 2000.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User

---------------------------------------------------------------

"rubyjack" <rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote in message news:e5EznNkKIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to set
it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete novice
to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a few
questions for me, I'd be very grateful.

If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do I
have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?
And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?


Thanks in advance,
Dan Hacker

--

-----------
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
-----------


Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Rick Rogers
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
Hi Dan,

Yes, it's possible. It's best to install the older OS first, and then the
newer one. This way the boot manager is set up for you. Since that's not an
option, you have two basic ways you can approach this.

a) First use disk manager to shring the size of your existing C: volume.
Then create a new volume from the free space, do not format it. Here's the
tricky part: To install Win2000 requires booting from a floppy and loading
the CD by running winnt.exe in the I386 folder from the command prompt. Let
install format the volume you created. When it completes, your Win2000
system will boot, but you will have lost access to the Vista installation.
You can either do a startup repair by booting the Vista DVD (if you have
one), or use VistaBootPro (easily found on google) to repair the mbr.

b) Use a third party boot manager and partitioning program like BootIT NG to
do the above disk operations. The main difference is that you will be able
to use it to create a separate boot entry and install path for Win2000
without damaging the Vista boot manager.

> If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do
> I
> have to install everything twice?


You have to install it under each OS. To prevent additional problems, if you
are going to do this you should actually create a third volume to use as a
common installation point. Otherwise you may run into numerous
permission/ownership issues.

> Can I repartition the HD under Windows
> without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?


You can, though diskmgmt.msc is by far not the best utilty for rearranging
and resizing volumes. A word of caution: Backup anything you do not want to
lose (family photos, downloaded program installers, etc.) to removable media
before you begin. While you should be able to do this without loss of data,
there are no guarantees that something will go wrong. Also, if your system
provides for making a set of recovery disks, then you should do so as well.
Installing another OS may cause you to lose access to any recovery volume on
the hard drive.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com

"rubyjack" <rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
news:e5EznNkKIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to set
> it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete
> novice
> to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a few
> questions for me, I'd be very grateful.
>
> If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do
> I
> have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
> without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?
> And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Dan Hacker
>
> --
>
> -----------
> Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
> forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
> -----------
>
>


Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Andy
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
The website "How to dual boot Vista and XP (with Vista installed
first) -- the step-by-step guide"
<http://apcmag.com/5485/dualbooting_vista_and_xp?page=1> gives you an
idea of what's involved in installing Windows XP. I don't know how
large your disk is, but Windows 2000 SP4 setup has a limitation that
it can access only up to 137GB in the hard disk, so its partition has
to lie below that point. It's easiest just to install another disk
drive, and install Windows 2000 on it.

On Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:30:16 -0600, "rubyjack"
<rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to set
>it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete novice
>to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a few
>questions for me, I'd be very grateful.
>
>If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do I
>have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
>without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?
>And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?
>
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Dan Hacker

Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
rubyjack
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
Rats!!!!!!!!!

Thanks so much for the warning. I have had a little experience with Vista,
and while it looks nice, it's a major change for me. I do have all the
disks for the computer, if Dell tells me the computer supports 2000, do you
still advise against a dual boot? What about a dual boot for Vista/XP?


Thanks again,
Dan Hacker

--

-----------
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
-----------
"Carey Frisch [MVP]" <cnfrisch@nospamgmail.com> wrote in message
news:BAD2A981-7C85-4852-9C95-A3E5BB6C907A@microsoft.com...
> It is not recommended to attempt to configure a
> dual-boot configuration with a factory preinstalled
> version of Windows Vista. You'll likely end up
> destroying your entire hard drive and have no
> operating system at all. Besides, your new Dell
> computer likely does not support Windows 2000.
>
> --
> Carey Frisch
> Microsoft MVP
> Windows Shell/User
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "rubyjack" <rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote in message

news:e5EznNkKIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to set
> it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete

novice
> to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a few
> questions for me, I'd be very grateful.
>
> If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or do

I
> have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
> without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do this?
> And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Dan Hacker
>
> --
>
> -----------
> Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
> forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
> -----------
>
>



Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
rubyjack
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
Rick, thanks for the reply.

My new computer does not have a floppy drive. However, the original W2000
disk that I have is bootable. Would this work instead of booting from a
floppy?

I'm not quite sure I understand the need for a third volume for software
installs. Do I use that volume to install all software that will be used by
both OS's?

I am well aware of the need for backups, and appreciate your advice about
the recovery disks. The system is brand spanking new, so there is no data
yet to backup, but there might actually be some useful software that needs
saving first.

I'll go looking for the software you suggested for the partitioning and
making a new mbr.


I really appreciate your help,
Dan Hacker

--

-----------
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
-----------
"Rick Rogers" <rick@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:O4ynHikKIHA.5360@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
> Hi Dan,
>
> Yes, it's possible. It's best to install the older OS first, and then the
> newer one. This way the boot manager is set up for you. Since that's not

an
> option, you have two basic ways you can approach this.
>
> a) First use disk manager to shring the size of your existing C: volume.
> Then create a new volume from the free space, do not format it. Here's the
> tricky part: To install Win2000 requires booting from a floppy and loading
> the CD by running winnt.exe in the I386 folder from the command prompt.

Let
> install format the volume you created. When it completes, your Win2000
> system will boot, but you will have lost access to the Vista installation.
> You can either do a startup repair by booting the Vista DVD (if you have
> one), or use VistaBootPro (easily found on google) to repair the mbr.
>
> b) Use a third party boot manager and partitioning program like BootIT NG

to
> do the above disk operations. The main difference is that you will be able
> to use it to create a separate boot entry and install path for Win2000
> without damaging the Vista boot manager.
>
> > If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or

do
> > I
> > have to install everything twice?

>
> You have to install it under each OS. To prevent additional problems, if

you
> are going to do this you should actually create a third volume to use as a
> common installation point. Otherwise you may run into numerous
> permission/ownership issues.
>
> > Can I repartition the HD under Windows
> > without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do

this?
>
> You can, though diskmgmt.msc is by far not the best utilty for rearranging
> and resizing volumes. A word of caution: Backup anything you do not want

to
> lose (family photos, downloaded program installers, etc.) to removable

media
> before you begin. While you should be able to do this without loss of

data,
> there are no guarantees that something will go wrong. Also, if your system
> provides for making a set of recovery disks, then you should do so as

well.
> Installing another OS may cause you to lose access to any recovery volume

on
> the hard drive.
>
> --
> Best of Luck,
>
> Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
> Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
> My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com
>
> "rubyjack" <rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
> news:e5EznNkKIHA.4752@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> >I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to

set
> > it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete
> > novice
> > to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a

few
> > questions for me, I'd be very grateful.
> >
> > If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or

do
> > I
> > have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under

Windows
> > without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do

this?
> > And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Dan Hacker
> >
> > --
> >
> > -----------
> > Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
> > forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
> > -----------
> >
> >

>



Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
rubyjack
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
Hmmmmm, never even thought about using a second disk drive. I have several
small lines lying around and could easily slap one in. However, I wouldn't
want to do this unless there is a separate IDE line, as I wouldn't want to
slow the new HD down. Then again, maybe I could master/slave it to the
optical drive. Would that still allow me to boot from it?


Thanks for the reply,
Dan Hacker

--

-----------
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods. Cats have never
forgotten this. -- Danbury Mint
-----------
"Andy" <1@2.3> wrote in message
news:l9c2k3louob7um37j0f14hbho08c53m41p@4ax.com...
> The website "How to dual boot Vista and XP (with Vista installed
> first) -- the step-by-step guide"
> <http://apcmag.com/5485/dualbooting_vista_and_xp?page=1> gives you an
> idea of what's involved in installing Windows XP. I don't know how
> large your disk is, but Windows 2000 SP4 setup has a limitation that
> it can access only up to 137GB in the hard disk, so its partition has
> to lie below that point. It's easiest just to install another disk
> drive, and install Windows 2000 on it.
>
> On Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:30:16 -0600, "rubyjack"
> <rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote:
>
> >I just got a Vista desktop computer (Dell Inspiron 531s). I'd like to

set
> >it up to dual boot to Windows 2000SP4/Windows Vista. I am a complete

novice
> >to dual booting, but not computers. If someone would like to answer a

few
> >questions for me, I'd be very grateful.
> >
> >If I install software under one OS, is it available to the other OS, or

do I
> >have to install everything twice? Can I repartition the HD under Windows
> >without reformatting the HD, or do I need third party software to do

this?
> >And last but not least, how do I setup a dual boot system?
> >
> >
> >Thanks in advance,
> >Dan Hacker



Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Donald L McDaniel
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
On Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:57:03 -0600, "rubyjack"
<rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>Rats!!!!!!!!!
>
>Thanks so much for the warning. I have had a little experience with Vista,
>and while it looks nice, it's a major change for me. I do have all the
>disks for the computer, if Dell tells me the computer supports 2000, do you
>still advise against a dual boot? What about a dual boot for Vista/XP?
>
>
>Thanks again,
>Dan Hacker


An XP/Vista dual-boot is MUCH more to be desired than 2k/Vista, since
the kernels are more similar. In addition, Vista will use a FEW XP
drivers, but NO 2k drivers. In any case, you will HAVE to have
necessary Vista-only drivers for such things as video, audio, and
printing, since Vista uses an ENTIRELY different driver-model for
those three. And unless you have all the Win2k drivers for your
devices, they will be worthless if you want to dual-boot between 2k
and Vista..

To dual-boot, Microsoft advises to install the OLDER Microsoft OS
FIRST, then install the newer one.
Example:
1) Dual-boot between 2k and Vista: Install 2k FIRST, on Partition 0,
Disk 0(C. then install Vista.
2) Dual-boot between XP and Vista: Install XP FIRST, on Partition 0,
Disk 0 (C, then install Vista.

I'm sure you get the idea now.

It is simply not possible to non-destructively re-partition your Vista
system disk with Microsoft-provided tools. This is true for ALL
Microsoft OSes.

If you want to do it Microsoft's way, you would first install XP
(repartition HDs destructively, then format the new partitions, and
install XP), making sure you leave enough free (unpartitioned) space
for Vista (I advise at least 40-80GB).

NOTE 1: If you install Vista (or XP) on a partition of GREATER than
32GB, you will NOT get a choice of formats: The installer will simply
format as NTFS. This is because Vista can only create FAT32
partitions smaller than 32GB. It cannot create a FAT32 volume larger
than 32GB. XP, however, will, up to 4TB. In my opinion, 32GB is
simply inadequate for Vista.
NOTE 2: Vista, however, WILL recognize a FAT32 partition >32GB, for
both reading and writing, IF it was created WITHOUT using Vista's
partitioning utility included in the Vista Installer. I don't advise
this. Use the OS installer's partitioning utilities.
NOTE3: If you DO want to re-partition non-destructively, you MUST use
a third-party utility like Symantec's Partition Magic 8.0 and above.
BTW, PM8.0 Trial will NOT save any changes you want to make, so to use
it as it is supposed to be used, you must buy a license from Symantec.

NOTE4: Neither XP or Vista will "automatically" partition/format your
drives. You MUST point the installer MANUALLY to the disk you want to
partition/format/install. If you are preparing the machine for the
dual-boot, I suggest that you do a "FULL" partition, rather than a
"QUICK" partition. A "full" partition will take about 30 minutes-1
hour, depending on size of partition, while a "Quick" partition will
take about 45 sec-1 min. It may take longer to do a "full" partition,
but it will pay dividends down the line. So go through the Setup
routine step-by-step, reading EVERYTHING on the screen, and following
it carefully.

NOTE5: If you choose to do an "Upgrade" installation, rather than a
"Clean" installation, make SURE you backup any files/folders you
absolutely want to save. In ANY case, do a backup of important files
BEFORE partitioning. While partitioning is relatively safe, anything
can happen, such as a power-failure while the partitioning is going on
(or during any write operation). Of course, that would not be good,
would it? and could lead to data loss, or even physical damage to your
drive(s). So BACK-UP your user-data, BACK-UP that BACK-UP, then
BACK-UP your user files on a daily or weekly basis. You never can be
too safe when it comes to such data.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Donald L McDaniel
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
On Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:26 -0500, "Rick Rogers" <rick@mvps.org>
wrote:

>Hi Dan,
>
>Yes, it's possible. It's best to install the older OS first, and then the
>newer one. This way the boot manager is set up for you. Since that's not an
>option, you have two basic ways you can approach this.
>
>a) First use disk manager to shring the size of your existing C: volume.
>Then create a new volume from the free space, do not format it. Here's the
>tricky part: To install Win2000 requires booting from a floppy and loading
>the CD by running winnt.exe in the I386 folder from the command prompt.


Rick, if I remember correctly (it's been so long), 2k Pro's install
disk is itself bootable, so a floppy would not necessarily be needed.

>Let install format the volume you created. When it completes, your Win2000
>system will boot, but you will have lost access to the Vista installation.
>You can either do a startup repair by booting the Vista DVD (if you have
>one), or use VistaBootPro (easily found on google) to repair the mbr.


How would he install Vista if he doesn't have the official DVD (or
some other kind of DVD containing the Vista images)?
Also, if I remember correctly, one can do both partitioning and
formatting of his partitions using the 2k Installer itself.

Which is why it's ALWAYS best to do it the Microsoft-supported way, by
installing the older OS FIRST. Then you won't have to do work-arounds
and repairs, and the Vista Boot Manager will work correctly
immediately.

>b) Use a third party boot manager and partitioning program like BootIT NG to
>do the above disk operations. The main difference is that you will be able
>to use it to create a separate boot entry and install path for Win2000
>without damaging the Vista boot manager.


I certainly don't advise this. Always use the native disk-prep tools
provided with an OS.

Donald McDaniel
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2007
Donald L McDaniel
 

Posts: n/a
Re: How to set up dual booting
On Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:10:28 -0600, "rubyjack"
<rubyjack@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>Rick, thanks for the reply.
>
>My new computer does not have a floppy drive. However, the original W2000
>disk that I have is bootable. Would this work instead of booting from a
>floppy?
>
>I'm not quite sure I understand the need for a third volume for software
>installs. Do I use that volume to install all software that will be used by
>both OS's?
>
>I am well aware of the need for backups, and appreciate your advice about
>the recovery disks. The system is brand spanking new, so there is no data
>yet to backup, but there might actually be some useful software that needs
>saving first.
>
>I'll go looking for the software you suggested for the partitioning and
>making a new mbr.
>
>
>I really appreciate your help,
>Dan Hacker


Please, Dan, do NOT use the suggested method. It will take MUCH more
time and work than doing it Microsoft's way. Additionally, BootMagic
REQUIRES that you FIRST create a FLOPPY, and do the partitioning from
it. It will be a waste of your time and money. Do it the Microsoft
way.

So your Vista install files are pre-installed? If so, you probably
got a lot of "crap-ware" along with the OS. I suggest you simply do
it the way Microsoft suggests.

If the OEM did not supply a Restore Disk, but put the install files in
a hidden partition, you should be able to create a set of installation
disks from within that partition, or from within Windows.

I definitely would not want to backup all the "crapware", since you
can get almost all of it online by downloading it anytime you want.

Unless you delete the hidden partition (if that's the way your OEM
chose to do it), you will NOT need to backup ANY software first.

BTW, IF you choose to re-partition your preinstalled OS volume, you
will NOT be able to do it from within Windows. PERIOD. It's just not
possible to delete or format a System volume from within Windows. You
would HAVE to boot from ANY volume BUT your System volume (C.
BootMagic chooses to make that bootable volume a FLOPPY, not their
installation disk. Useless for those like us who have no floppy
drives.

Since you have a virgin HD, do it the right way, using Microsoft's
provided tools.

Donald McDaniel
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