Winhlp32.exe *STILL* MIA!

In message <iplat29jmtbsn28plq7mjrvf0h9ugkgm6e@4ax.com> "cquirke (MVP
Windows shell/user)" <cquirkenews@nospam.mvps.org> wrote:

>Maybe the thought is that if you've had an app since the days of
>WinHelp .HLP files, you don't need Help anymore?

Or maybe there are still modern apps using the format since their help
files have never really been re-engineered from scratch.

>There may be reasons why Help / .HLP needs to be re-engineered. At
>one time in the history of .HLP, it was thought to be kewl to let .HLP
>files "do it for you", i.e. launch code - and indeed that can be very
>helpful, compared to about reading 15 UI-deep clicks to reach a dialog
>box and then having to do those clicks while trying to keep both .HLP
>and dialogs visible. But it also means malware can use .HLP as a
>delivery system, and today the focus will be on that.

And?

What can a HLP file do that an EXE cannot? Why bother with HLP based
malware when it's just as simple to get the end user to run an EXE?

Worse, have you seen Vista's help? It happily launches apps from within
the help interface, so at a minimum, this is a "those who do not learn
from history" situation, or a case of "we're Microsoft, do as we say,
not as we do"
--
Insert something clever here.

On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 09:15:19 +0200, "cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)"
<cquirkenews@nospam.mvps.org> spake thusly:

>On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:41:46 GMT, Scott
>
>>"I overpaid for the "Ultimate" version of Windows Vista 64-bit and
>>you're telling me I can't view the help files from some of my
>>programs?
>
>>Your supposed 'support' document (
>>http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607 ) makes no mention of USERS,
>>just DEVELOPERS.
>
>>What about us poor slobs, the users?
>
>>This is insane. Previously you promised (same KB article) to offer
>>winhlp32.exe as download for Vista users after January 30, 2007, yet
>>you've updated (today!) the above mentioned KB article and now make no
>>mention of that download
>
>>One of my FAVORITE programs works just fine in Vista, (unless I want
>>help, that is.)"
>
>Maybe the thought is that if you've had an app since the days of
>WinHelp .HLP files, you don't need Help anymore?

Who say's I've had the app that long silly boy?

http://sourceforge.net/projects/cdexos/

I brought the .hlp issue to the developers attention a few months ago,
but since s/he probably works on this when time permits for gratis,
I'm not expecting a prompt response.

outside of that little glitch, this is the best damn CD ripping app
out there AND it's free of charge and open source.

It not only rips CDs 50 different ways, it's a toaster AND a floor
wax!
--
Scott http://angrykeyboarder.com

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?

Hello,
The winhlp32.exe is coming.
It just didn't make the January 30th date.
Thanks,
Darrell Gorter[MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights
--------------------
|>From: Scott <geekboy@angrykeyboarder.comatose>
|>Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windows.vista.general
|>Subject: Re: Winhlp32.exe *STILL* MIA!
|>Organization: angrykeyboarder.com - http://angrykeyboarder.com
|>Message-ID: <n1hbt2h83lq0v90eueo8o2g2h099807hhs@4ax.com>
|>References: <e6p4t2t611vmpmif0ccse2kk6f1di3hgsi@4ax.com>
<iplat29jmtbsn28plq7mjrvf0h9ugkgm6e@4ax.com>
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|>
|>On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 09:15:19 +0200, "cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)"
|><cquirkenews@nospam.mvps.org> spake thusly:
|>
|>>On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:41:46 GMT, Scott
|>>
|>>>"I overpaid for the "Ultimate" version of Windows Vista 64-bit and
|>>>you're telling me I can't view the help files from some of my
|>>>programs?
|>>
|>>>Your supposed 'support' document (
|>>>http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607 ) makes no mention of USERS,
|>>>just DEVELOPERS.
|>>
|>>>What about us poor slobs, the users?
|>>
|>>>This is insane. Previously you promised (same KB article) to offer
|>>>winhlp32.exe as download for Vista users after January 30, 2007, yet
|>>>you've updated (today!) the above mentioned KB article and now make no
|>>>mention of that download
|>>
|>>>One of my FAVORITE programs works just fine in Vista, (unless I want
|>>>help, that is.)"
|>>
|>>Maybe the thought is that if you've had an app since the days of
|>>WinHelp .HLP files, you don't need Help anymore?
|>
|>Who say's I've had the app that long silly boy?
|>
|>http://sourceforge.net/projects/cdexos/
|>
|>I brought the .hlp issue to the developers attention a few months ago,
|>but since s/he probably works on this when time permits for gratis,
|>I'm not expecting a prompt response.
|>
|>outside of that little glitch, this is the best damn CD ripping app
|>out there AND it's free of charge and open source.
|>
|>It not only rips CDs 50 different ways, it's a toaster AND a floor
|>wax!
|>--
|> Scott http://angrykeyboarder.com
|>
|>A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
|>Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
|>

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 00:09:40 GMT, Darrellg@online.microsoft.com
("Darrell Gorter[MSFT]") spake thusly:

>Hello,
>The winhlp32.exe is coming.
>It just didn't make the January 30th date.
>Thanks,
>Darrell Gorter[MSFT]
>

I got your message the first time, but thanks again.
--
Scott http://angrykeyboarder.com

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?

On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:57:17 -0700, DevilsPGD
>In message "cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)"

>What can a HLP file do that an EXE cannot? Why bother with HLP based
>malware when it's just as simple to get the end user to run an EXE?

Various reasons:
- to bypass file type filters
- to mis-represent the level of risk to users
- as a generic infection mechanism (infect existing .HLP files)

It's not always "just as simple" to get a user to run an .EXE, and
several sites may make that very difficult indeed.

>Worse, have you seen Vista's help? It happily launches apps from within
>the help interface, so at a minimum, this is a "those who do not learn
>from history" situation, or a case of "we're Microsoft, do as we say,
>not as we do"

Yep, I was wondering about that. There may be levels of detail that
apply, that make .CHM-based Help easier to manage or secure.

IMO, .HLP was a missed opportunity to become what .PDF is today, had
MS built native .HLP authoring into MS Word... then again, it is said
that one of the limitations of .HLP is poor searchability.



>--------------- ---- --- -- - - - -
Saws are too hard to use.
Be easier to use!
>--------------- ---- --- -- - - - -

I just fired off an angry email to Microsoft.

==============

"I overpaid for the "Ultimate" version of Windows Vista 64-bit and
you're telling me I can't view the help files from some of my
programs?

Your supposed 'support' document (
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607 ) makes no mention of USERS,
just DEVELOPERS.

What about us poor slobs, the users?

This is insane. Previously you promised (same KB article) to offer
winhlp32.exe as download for Vista users after January 30, 2007, yet
you've updated (today!) the above mentioned KB article and now make no
mention of that download

This TRULY SUCKS.

One of my FAVORITE programs works just fine in Vista, (unless I want
help, that is.)"

==============

There, I feel better now.

Hello Scott,
The download for Winhlp32.exe is coming. It wasn't going to make the
January 30th date so the article was changed to not reflect the incorrect
date.
Projecting dates for releases of updates is not always accurate, if issues
crop up that delay, expectations around a delivery date are no met.
The article will be updated when the release is made available.
Thanks,
Darrell Gorter[MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights
--------------------
|>From: Scott <geekboy@angrykeyboarder.comatose>
|>Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windows.vista.general
|>Subject: Winhlp32.exe *STILL* MIA!
|>Organization: angrykeyboarder.com - http://angrykeyboarder.com
|>Message-ID: <e6p4t2t611vmpmif0ccse2kk6f1di3hgsi@4ax.com>
|>X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 4.2/32.1117
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|>X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
|>Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:41:46 GMT
|>Path:
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|>Xref: TK2MSFTNGHUB02.phx.gbl microsoft.public.windows.vista.general:38295
|>X-Tomcat-NG: microsoft.public.windows.vista.general
|>
|>I just fired off an angry email to Microsoft.
|>
|>==============
|>
|>"I overpaid for the "Ultimate" version of Windows Vista 64-bit and
|>you're telling me I can't view the help files from some of my
|>programs?
|>
|>Your supposed 'support' document (
|>http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607 ) makes no mention of USERS,
|>just DEVELOPERS.
|>
|>What about us poor slobs, the users?
|>
|>This is insane. Previously you promised (same KB article) to offer
|>winhlp32.exe as download for Vista users after January 30, 2007, yet
|>you've updated (today!) the above mentioned KB article and now make no
|>mention of that download
|>
|>This TRULY SUCKS.
|>
|>One of my FAVORITE programs works just fine in Vista, (unless I want
|>help, that is.)"
|>
|>==============
|>
|>There, I feel better now.
|>

On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 02:06:55 GMT, Darrellg@online.microsoft.com
("Darrell Gorter[MSFT]") spake thusly:

>Hello Scott,
>The download for Winhlp32.exe is coming. It wasn't going to make the
>January 30th date so the article was changed to not reflect the incorrect
>date.

Wow. I didn't realize Microsoft folks participated here!

>Projecting dates for releases of updates is not always accurate, if issues
>crop up that delay, expectations around a delivery date are no [sic] met.

I understand, but perhaps saying "at a future date" rather than
nothing at all (patricianly since a date had been previously
mentioned).

>The article will be updated when the release is made available.
>Thanks,
>Darrell Gorter[MSFT]

Thank you. I appreciate your unexpected attention and quick response.

Scott

Hello Scott,
I checked on this last week, I was the reason the article got updated to
remove the date since we were past it already.
I try to answer a few questions when I have time
Thanks,
Darrell Gorter[MSFT]

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights
--------------------
|>From: Scott <geekboy@angrykeyboarder.comatose>
|>Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windows.vista.general
|>Subject: Re: Winhlp32.exe *STILL* MIA!
|>Organization: angrykeyboarder.com - http://angrykeyboarder.com
|>Message-ID: <jbt4t29gv3gchaeaura03t37f13o3it9cd@4ax.com>
|>References: <e6p4t2t611vmpmif0ccse2kk6f1di3hgsi@4ax.com>
<q$1PQz9THHA.900@TK2MSFTNGHUB02.phx.gbl>
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|>X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
|>Lines: 24
|>X-Complaints-To: abuse@easynews.com
|>X-Complaints-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly.
|>Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 02:39:07 GMT
|>Path:
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|>X-Tomcat-NG: microsoft.public.windows.vista.general
|>
|>On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 02:06:55 GMT, Darrellg@online.microsoft.com
|>("Darrell Gorter[MSFT]") spake thusly:
|>
|>>Hello Scott,
|>>The download for Winhlp32.exe is coming. It wasn't going to make the
|>>January 30th date so the article was changed to not reflect the
incorrect
|>>date.
|>
|>Wow. I didn't realize Microsoft folks participated here!
|>
|>>Projecting dates for releases of updates is not always accurate, if
issues
|>>crop up that delay, expectations around a delivery date are no [sic] met.
|>
|>I understand, but perhaps saying "at a future date" rather than
|>nothing at all (patricianly since a date had been previously
|>mentioned).
|>
|>>The article will be updated when the release is made available.
|>>Thanks,
|>>Darrell Gorter[MSFT]
|>
|>Thank you. I appreciate your unexpected attention and quick response.
|>
|>Scott
|>

If you have XP you can copy the XP version of WINHlp32.exe over to the
VISTA installation. There's a stub file in VISTA of the same name that
you need to rename or delete and to do that you need to have
permission.

If you know how to do that you'll find that earlier HELP works fine.

If you don't ask because I can't exactly remember how I went about it
but I got there in the end.