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IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work

microsoft.public.internetexplorer.general






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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009
Ron
 

Posts: n/a
IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Hi,
Here is my situation:
I set up 3rd party cookies to "Prompt".
I received messages about cookies. Some I approved, and some i did not.
After some time, i notices that some sites do not work, informing me that
"cookies are not enabled".
I then enabled all 3rd party cookies.
BUT, the ones that I have rejected still are rejected, and I have not found
a way to re-enable those that i have rejected.
Just to check, I used another browser and was able to get to these sites.
I prefer to use IE8, but am unable to do so now, with these sites.

My educated guess is that rejected cookies site are saved in the registry,
and changing IE8 setting to enable all cookies does not erase that.

Please help
Thanks
Ron
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009
VanguardLH
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Ron wrote:

> I set up 3rd party cookies to "Prompt". I received messages about
> cookies. Some I approved, and some i did not. After some time, i
> notices that some sites do not work, informing me that "cookies are
> not enabled". I then enabled all 3rd party cookies. BUT, the ones
> that I have rejected still are rejected, and I have not found a way
> to re-enable those that i have rejected.


Have you yet purged the web browser's TIF folder to get rid of the old
cookie files? If the Preserve option is enabled, not all cookies will
get deleted. Disable the Preserve option and then do another purge.

Once you changed IE's cookie handling to allow 3rd party cookies, did
you also remove all domains from the Allow/Block site list? Click the
"Sites" button to check the list.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009
Ron
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
If i delete all the cookies, it takes so much time to login to everything.
It is annoying.
I tried that once. It did not help

On the allow/block site, i do not want to delete it.
I have accumulated a lot of really bad sites that I want to block. I do not
want to loose it.

It looks like both suggestions are kind of a work-around.
They are a big problem for me.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks
Ron

"VanguardLH" wrote:

> Ron wrote:
>
> > I set up 3rd party cookies to "Prompt". I received messages about
> > cookies. Some I approved, and some i did not. After some time, i
> > notices that some sites do not work, informing me that "cookies are
> > not enabled". I then enabled all 3rd party cookies. BUT, the ones
> > that I have rejected still are rejected, and I have not found a way
> > to re-enable those that i have rejected.

>
> Have you yet purged the web browser's TIF folder to get rid of the old
> cookie files? If the Preserve option is enabled, not all cookies will
> get deleted. Disable the Preserve option and then do another purge.
>
> Once you changed IE's cookie handling to allow 3rd party cookies, did
> you also remove all domains from the Allow/Block site list? Click the
> "Sites" button to check the list.
>

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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2009
VanguardLH
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Ron wrote:

> If i delete all the cookies, it takes so much time to login to
> everything. It is annoying. I tried that once. It did not help


Still you haven't said that the Preserve option was disabled when you
"tried that once". Many users don't bother to review the options in IE
so they don't even know about the Preserve option.

You can go into %userprofile%\Cookies and delete only the cookie .txt
files that you want.

> On the allow/block site, i do not want to delete it. I have
> accumulated a lot of really bad sites that I want to block. I do not
> want to loose it.


I said nothing about clicking the Remove All button under the cookie
Sites list. Pick the ones you no longer want to block and just remove
THOSE domains from the Sites list.

> It looks like both suggestions are kind of a work-around. They are a
> big problem for me.


That you don't want to remove the domain from the Sites list is your
choice. You chose to add the domain so its cookies are blocked. It
will remain so until make a different choice.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2009
Ron
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Well, if you do not see the problem here, than I am sorry.

It means that if I chose not to accept specific cookies once, it is kept
forever.
I do not know which cookies I have blocked.
Now, if I go and enable all cookies, IE ignores my new settings and still
remembers my old setting of not allowing this site to save the cookie.
I have hundreds of bad sites collected thru the years. I will not delete
them all.
Finding the specific problem is impossible. I have no way of knowing whick
cookies a specific site needs (many time it is of a separate login server).

Going and deleting specific cookies or sites is not an acceptable option for
normal users. I am a computer professional and I was not able to find out why
Yahoo and Facebook are not working.

Unfortunately, I will need to use a different browser to access the sites I
have blocked, but unable to unblock.

I hope they will fix it in the next version.

Thanks
Ron

"VanguardLH" wrote:

> Ron wrote:
>
> > If i delete all the cookies, it takes so much time to login to
> > everything. It is annoying. I tried that once. It did not help

>
> Still you haven't said that the Preserve option was disabled when you
> "tried that once". Many users don't bother to review the options in IE
> so they don't even know about the Preserve option.
>
> You can go into %userprofile%\Cookies and delete only the cookie .txt
> files that you want.
>
> > On the allow/block site, i do not want to delete it. I have
> > accumulated a lot of really bad sites that I want to block. I do not
> > want to loose it.

>
> I said nothing about clicking the Remove All button under the cookie
> Sites list. Pick the ones you no longer want to block and just remove
> THOSE domains from the Sites list.
>
> > It looks like both suggestions are kind of a work-around. They are a
> > big problem for me.

>
> That you don't want to remove the domain from the Sites list is your
> choice. You chose to add the domain so its cookies are blocked. It
> will remain so until make a different choice.
>

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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2009
VanguardLH
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Ron wrote:

> It means that if I chose not to accept specific cookies once, it is
> kept forever.


Yep, the choice is to use the rules you configured to manage cookies
along with exceptions in an Allow/Block list that you maintain. If you
don't want to use exceptions then don't use the Allow/Block sites list.
Exceptions OVERRIDE the cookies rules you chose. That's why they are
"exceptions to the rules".

> I do not know which cookies I have blocked.


The sites list for cookies lists them by their domains. Since you know
the domain of the site where you blocked cookies for it, just scroll
down the sites list until you find that domain. Cookie blocking is
domain based, not tied to a particular page at a domain.

There is no Search function included in the cookies site list. Maybe
that's what you are complaining about. But then how hard is it to
scroll through an alphabetically sorted list to find the domains of
interest? You could use a file search on the Cookies folder of which I
mentioned if you want to do it that way to find cookie .txt files that
contain the domain's name in them.

> Now, if I go and enable all cookies, IE ignores my new settings and
> still remembers my old setting of not allowing this site to save the
> cookie.


The Allow/Block list is an override list. You define general rules for
handling cookies. You make exceptions to those rules by adding domains
to the sites list and choosing to Allow or Block cookies on those
domains.

> I have hundreds of bad sites collected thru the years. I will not
> delete them all.


The vast majority of which would be handled by setting the cookie rules
to block 3rd party cookies. If you are actually visiting those bad
sites then that was your choice and cookie management isn't going to
help with protecting you from their "badness". If they are bad sites,
why are you visiting them?

> Finding the specific problem is impossible. I have no way of knowing
> whick cookies a specific site needs (many time it is of a separate
> login server).


Cookies are defined by the domain to which they belong. You will see
the domain name if you use Windows Explorer to visit your Cookies
folder (it's after the "@" in the filename). The domains will be
listed in the Allow/Block sites list. Cookies are managed by domain,
not by a web page. If the login page goes to a different domain
(itself a red flag that you probably shouldn't be at that site) then
you still know that domain and you can find the cookie(s) for it by
scrolling down the Sites list.

> Going and deleting specific cookies or sites is not an acceptable
> option for normal users.


Normal users don't go adding thousands of entries into their cookie site
list. Blocking 3rd party cookies already takes care of the vast
majority of perceived problems with those cookies. Normal users would
use the default cookie rules which would eliminate a lot of those
visited 1st party sites from creating cookies that can only be used by
3rd parties, or they change from testing the cookie for policy and
instead just block ALL 3rd party cookies. If it is a "bad" site, normal
users wouldn't be visiting them anyway to have their 1st party cookies
saved on their host.

If you actually visit those "bad" sites then cookies are the least of
your worries. They don't need to use a cookie to track your web
navigation. They already have your IP address when you connected to
them and can save that in their database (which can also be shared with
other parties to generate even more revenue). If you are adding blocked
domains in your cookies list then you shouldn't be visiting those sites.
Since you won't be visiting those sites, any cookies for them will
always be 3rd party cookies and that is easily managed in the cookie
rules. If you add a allow/block exception then, well, they are
*exceptions* to your rules.

> I am a computer professional and I was not able to find out why Yahoo
> and Facebook are not working.


That's an whole other discussion.

> Unfortunately, I will need to use a different browser to access the
> sites I have blocked, but unable to unblock.


Once you block them, they remain blocked until you choose otherwise.
After all, what would be the point of a block if it was never honored?
That's like hiring a bouncer that never bounces the rowdy patrons. If
you don't want to use exceptions then don't. If you do use them then it
is up to YOU to manage them. That you are unwilling to scroll through a
sorted list of domains doesn't reflect that you are the professional
that you claim.

> I hope they will fix it in the next version.


Probably not. Nothing to fix. It you want it blocked, your choice.
If you want it allowed, your choice. If you want to change your
choice, still your choice. If you want to see if cookies are getting
blocked when visiting a site, look in the status bar to see the hashed
circle (hazard icon) is displayed which means some cookies got blocked.
Double-click on the hazard icon to see what cookies got blocked.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2009
Ron
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
I am sorry you missed my point about the fix.

I do not use the block/allow list.
It was filled be a security software package.
Then I set the 3rd party cookies to "Prompt".
I then rejected some 3rd party cookies, only to find later that some site
stopped working.

Again, I did not enter domains into the list. I just rejected them when
prompted.
When Facebook stopped working (complaining the the cookies are blocked), I
searched the list for Facebook, and even entered Facebook as "Allowed". That
did not help.

Your suggestion in your last sentence about checking the hazard icon is
probably what i was looking for to resolve this problem.

Thank you for your patience.

Ron



"VanguardLH" wrote:

> Ron wrote:
>
> > It means that if I chose not to accept specific cookies once, it is
> > kept forever.

>
> Yep, the choice is to use the rules you configured to manage cookies
> along with exceptions in an Allow/Block list that you maintain. If you
> don't want to use exceptions then don't use the Allow/Block sites list.
> Exceptions OVERRIDE the cookies rules you chose. That's why they are
> "exceptions to the rules".
>
> > I do not know which cookies I have blocked.

>
> The sites list for cookies lists them by their domains. Since you know
> the domain of the site where you blocked cookies for it, just scroll
> down the sites list until you find that domain. Cookie blocking is
> domain based, not tied to a particular page at a domain.
>
> There is no Search function included in the cookies site list. Maybe
> that's what you are complaining about. But then how hard is it to
> scroll through an alphabetically sorted list to find the domains of
> interest? You could use a file search on the Cookies folder of which I
> mentioned if you want to do it that way to find cookie .txt files that
> contain the domain's name in them.
>
> > Now, if I go and enable all cookies, IE ignores my new settings and
> > still remembers my old setting of not allowing this site to save the
> > cookie.

>
> The Allow/Block list is an override list. You define general rules for
> handling cookies. You make exceptions to those rules by adding domains
> to the sites list and choosing to Allow or Block cookies on those
> domains.
>
> > I have hundreds of bad sites collected thru the years. I will not
> > delete them all.

>
> The vast majority of which would be handled by setting the cookie rules
> to block 3rd party cookies. If you are actually visiting those bad
> sites then that was your choice and cookie management isn't going to
> help with protecting you from their "badness". If they are bad sites,
> why are you visiting them?
>
> > Finding the specific problem is impossible. I have no way of knowing
> > whick cookies a specific site needs (many time it is of a separate
> > login server).

>
> Cookies are defined by the domain to which they belong. You will see
> the domain name if you use Windows Explorer to visit your Cookies
> folder (it's after the "@" in the filename). The domains will be
> listed in the Allow/Block sites list. Cookies are managed by domain,
> not by a web page. If the login page goes to a different domain
> (itself a red flag that you probably shouldn't be at that site) then
> you still know that domain and you can find the cookie(s) for it by
> scrolling down the Sites list.
>
> > Going and deleting specific cookies or sites is not an acceptable
> > option for normal users.

>
> Normal users don't go adding thousands of entries into their cookie site
> list. Blocking 3rd party cookies already takes care of the vast
> majority of perceived problems with those cookies. Normal users would
> use the default cookie rules which would eliminate a lot of those
> visited 1st party sites from creating cookies that can only be used by
> 3rd parties, or they change from testing the cookie for policy and
> instead just block ALL 3rd party cookies. If it is a "bad" site, normal
> users wouldn't be visiting them anyway to have their 1st party cookies
> saved on their host.
>
> If you actually visit those "bad" sites then cookies are the least of
> your worries. They don't need to use a cookie to track your web
> navigation. They already have your IP address when you connected to
> them and can save that in their database (which can also be shared with
> other parties to generate even more revenue). If you are adding blocked
> domains in your cookies list then you shouldn't be visiting those sites.
> Since you won't be visiting those sites, any cookies for them will
> always be 3rd party cookies and that is easily managed in the cookie
> rules. If you add a allow/block exception then, well, they are
> *exceptions* to your rules.
>
> > I am a computer professional and I was not able to find out why Yahoo
> > and Facebook are not working.

>
> That's an whole other discussion.
>
> > Unfortunately, I will need to use a different browser to access the
> > sites I have blocked, but unable to unblock.

>
> Once you block them, they remain blocked until you choose otherwise.
> After all, what would be the point of a block if it was never honored?
> That's like hiring a bouncer that never bounces the rowdy patrons. If
> you don't want to use exceptions then don't. If you do use them then it
> is up to YOU to manage them. That you are unwilling to scroll through a
> sorted list of domains doesn't reflect that you are the professional
> that you claim.
>
> > I hope they will fix it in the next version.

>
> Probably not. Nothing to fix. It you want it blocked, your choice.
> If you want it allowed, your choice. If you want to change your
> choice, still your choice. If you want to see if cookies are getting
> blocked when visiting a site, look in the status bar to see the hashed
> circle (hazard icon) is displayed which means some cookies got blocked.
> Double-click on the hazard icon to see what cookies got blocked.
>

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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2009
VanguardLH
 

Posts: n/a
Re: IE bug? disabling cookies and then enabling does not work
Ron wrote:

> I am sorry you missed my point about the fix.
>
> I do not use the block/allow list.
> It was filled be a security software package.


So it isn't an IE issue but instead an issue with whatever is the
"security software package" where the blocking was performed. Or did
you mean that this security software added a bunch of domains to the
cookie allow/block site list, as will SpywareBlaster or Spybot S&D?

> Then I set the 3rd party cookies to "Prompt".
> I then rejected some 3rd party cookies, only to find later that some site
> stopped working.


Blocking cookies (1st or 3rd party) can cause a problem at some sites,
just like blocking advertisements. They can see that their content is
not being retrieved and decide not to offer all or any of their content.

> Again, I did not enter domains into the list. I just rejected them when
> prompted.


When IE presents its prompt, you can elect to Allow the creation of the
3rd party cookie, Block it, and also whether or not to remember your
selection. If you allow or block but do choose not to remember your
selection, you will get re-prompted for the same 3rd party domain. Some
sites will create multiple 3rd party cookies several times while
rendering their web page. If you don't remember your selection, you
keep getting re-prompted when you haven't even left the page yet.

If you enable the option to remember your selection, that domain will
get added to the cookie sites list. It looks like you were blocking but
not choosing to remember that selection.

> When Facebook stopped working (complaining the the cookies are blocked), I
> searched the list for Facebook, and even entered Facebook as "Allowed". That
> did not help.


Sometimes you can get around the blocked cookie problem if you add a
site to the Trusted Sites security zone. However, I personally would
not blindly trust Facebook.

> Your suggestion in your last sentence about checking the hazard icon is
> probably what i was looking for to resolve this problem.


Be aware that not just loss of cookies can cause a site to no longer
function properly. Some users also incorporate ad-blockers (as filters
or add-ons) which can render a site inoperable. The site expects to
retrieve objects from those locations but which are getting blocked so
their script that expects those objects will fail. As an example, I
couldn't get to my ISP's webmail page after logging in (I'd login, there
was an intervening banner page, and then I was back at the login page
instead of showing their webmail page). Turned out the problem was the
ad-blocker was preventing navigation through some pages at the site. I
had to make a correction (by way of an exception) to the ad-blocker so I
could use my ISP's webmail page.

It would be handy if there was an option to make the hazard icon
(showing something got blocked at the site by IE's settings) to blink,
rotate, change colors, or otherwise draw attention to itself. That it
shows up doesn't exactly draw your attention to a little graphic showing
up at the bottom of the window in the status bar.
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